A thought occurred to me last night while watching a YouTube video about Thanos’ Snap: were the people who became dust selected at random? At first glance I always assumed so, but maybe not.
I’m not a mathematician, and questions of probability can confound even professors of mathematics.
I’ll lay out my reasoning and you tell me if I missed something in the comments.
We know Dr. Strange observed 14,000,605 outcomes of the conflict with Thanos, and in only one of those outcomes did it end satisfactorily for the Avengers in Endgame.
Spoilers follow for Avengers: Infinity War and Endgame. Make sure you’ve seen these before reading further!
The question is: how did Dr. Strange know Tony Stark/Iron Man would not be dusted?
The simple answer: Dr. Strange watched the outcome and knew Tony survived after a certain chain of events occurred.
Right? Then the snap itself does not randomly select lifeforms to dust. If an event — Tony surviving The Snap — always follows a chain of previous events, then it is a determined event, and not random.
If the snap itself randomly selects, then each snap will select a different set of lifeforms to dust. Therefore, all Dr. Strange could know is there’s one chain of events that ends well for the Avengers, as long as Tony doesn’t get dusted.
Remember, based on the outcome of Avengers: Endgame, the only solution Dr. Strange saw was for Tony to be the one, and the ONLY one, to reverse The Snap.
Creator and developer of the RunPee app. When something doesn’t work right in the app it’s pretty much his fault. 🙂
Aspiring author. Would like to finish his “Zombie Revelations” trilogy if he could break away for working on RunPee and the cottage he’s building for RunPee Mom.
NOTE: Spoilers start right away for Avengers: Endgame.
Although it’s a beautiful moment in Avengers: Endgame when Dr. Strange‘s portals opened and The Vanished step back into existence, the sudden return of all these people is very problematic.
Let’s assume for a minute Strange’s sorcerers planned ahead and saved all the people in planes from falling from the sky, teleporting them to safe landings. And so on for any Earthly or cosmically-based beings whose sudden reappearance would mean imminent death. I mean, if Strange can look into 14 million + lifetimes in the course of moments, I’ll wank he planned ahead for these literal car-wrecks, and many other contingencies too.
Captain America returned the Time Stone to the Sorcerer Supreme’s custody at the end of Endgame, so The Ancient One and Strange have an infinite amount of time to make sure the Endgame strategy didn’t cause a brand new Decimation.
But what then? What happens after The Snap is Unsnapped?
When the Infinity War saga finally ends and people try to go home, where do they go? It’s been five years. That’s quite a bit of time. Most people won’t have homes to return to. What happens when you find your house/palace/apartment/shack occupied by other people? What are the legalities of this? What would Judge Judy do? We have no precedent to fall back on. It’s not like people weren’t paying their rent because they lost their jobs — they were literally snuffed out and in of existence.
And as for returning to their families, that’s a can of worms even Ant-Man can’t open. When Hank Pym brought his wife back, he hadn’t moved on. Hope grew up in the interim, which was fine, but Janet was a welcome addition, not an interloper to someone’s new family. Hawkeye might now be five years older compared to his wife and kids, but he still had their house and hadn’t moved on either.
So — best case scenario for those returned is their loved ones pined away for half a decade, and now have huge mental traumas to process from living in the post-Snap world. Best case.
Worst case: their loved ones suddenly (from their POV) have new mates and children and are stuck with no one to help them re-assimilate into society. I doubt our world governments (outside of Wakanda) will do much besides creating homeless shelters and long food lines. Jobs will be gone. Society’s infrastructure won’t run right for years. The aftereffects of this kind of world-wide/universe-wide event should reverberate for at least a generation.
How does Spider-Man: Far From Home deal with the new reality?
This barely touches on the problems inherent in the Avengers’ plan to “bring them back, whatever it takes.” Spider-Man 2: Far From Home (coming out this July) will delve into some of this. Far From Home is the last film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe’s Phase Three.
Honestly, I don’t see how Far From Home can do these issues justice. Sure, they will make some nod to the problems in the beginning of the film. But keep in mind this is a SPIDER-MAN movie, with all the humor and hijinks we expect from Peter Parker & Gang (all conveniently also Snapped, and thus still in high school).
Spending the entire next blockbuster showing how people will be housed and fed and have their property returned wouldn’t be much fun.
This video raises some good questions about how our planet would deal with the return of billions of people, and even touches on the deep items of religion and spirituality that would be affected when our understanding of death is irrevocably changed:
PS: Black Panther 2 – Who is King in Wakanda?
One great side question asked in this video: who’s been running Wakanda for the past five years? I always assumed Shuri would take up the mantle, until it was revealed in the Endgame trailers she was Snapped too. And if someone like M’Baku became King, are there any heart-shaped herbs left to give him Black Panther powers? Either way, does T’Challa automatically become King again (heartfelt Endgame coda aside)? Let’s assume Black Panther 2 deals with this. It’s going to be hard to make that interesting, since the first Black Panther movie already tread this ground in some detail.
Co-Creator of RunPee, Chief of Operations, Content Director, and Managing Editor. RunPee Jilly likes galaxy-spanning sci fi, superhero sagas, fantasy films, YA dystopians, action thrillers, chick flicks, and zany comedies, in that order…and possesses an inspiringly small bladder. In fact, that little bladder sparked the creation of RunPee. (Good thing she’s learned to hold it.)
The Avengers most to blame, who come to mind right away are:
Star Lord — Mainly just a normal human with specialized combat melee skills. Peter Quill is just a petty thief trying to be a better person. He’s only slightly better at being ‘good’ than Rocket or Drax, after all.
Thor — God of Thunder — Should know better than to gloat after 1500 years of Godhood. You’re still not worthy yet, are you?
Dr. Strange — The jury is out til Endgame resolves. Next.
Captain America — WTF dude! YOU! J’accuse!
Hulk — The Big Green Guy who let us all all down. Just because you have issues with Banner doesn’t excuse toddler tantrums, big guy.
Breaking this down a bit more. Each of these heroes, and a few others, have some big burdens to bear.
Star Lord — Everyone blames him for the events on Titan. Peter Quill isn’t the sharpest crayon in the Crayola box, but I don’t blame him. It looked like he totally screwed the pooch in Infinity War, didn’t it? He really lost it for our guys on Titan..but, remember, Dr. Strange had to make it look good for his ONE future they would win. That means whatever “Mr. Lord” did was part of the plan. Also, Peter Quill never set out to be a hero — he just wants his girlfriend back. His investment strategy — Gamora: everything. Universe: whatever.
Hey, THOR — He just HAD to gloat. Not only should he have gone for the head, he should have gone for the arm. But Thor, mighty and all, isn’t the smartest Avenger. Maybe being cute is a liability. A god should do better. Head, arm…you haven’t learned a thing in 1500 years, have you?
Dr. Strange — I don’t blame him at all. He spent what — hundreds of years looking at alternate realities? I’m sure he knew what he was doing when he gave Thanos the time stone. He’s not stupid and we know he made it clear to Stark what his priorities were. There were no mistakes made here. Place your bets with Strange.
Cap — I blame him, really, mostly. We don’t trade lives??? Really? Much as I love Vision, this should have been a non-starter. Get that Stone out of Vision now, K? Even Wanda knew this had to happen. Shuri could have fixed this much earlier, and the ending would have been different. We DO trade lives, Cap. Have you not been watching all these movies? Sacrifice is part of the game. You don’t get to win everything just because you want it enough.
Hulk. He couldn’t be bothered to help Earth, or the universe, for that matter. Poor Banner. Poor us. He has a lot to make up for. I know: Hulk is the mental equivalent of a toddler, but that’s no excuse. #HulkSmash… #Smash??? Where did he go? Why leave Banner in a Hulkbuster suit? We better find out why.
Gamora — Thanos never would have found the soul stone without Gamora just giving it to him. I know he was torturing Nebula…but look at the result. I know it’s not nice to talk ill of the departed, but if there’s blame to go around, she should shoulder one infinity stone’s worth.
While we’re talking about about the stones, what about Loki? He gave Thanos the Tesseract for the same reason Gamora gave him the soul stone — to prevent more sibling torture. Also, remember Asgard getting munched during Ragnarok? Loki probably should have left the Tesseract in the vault.
So, who is to blame, besides (obviously) Thanos?
I know a lot of people blame Star Lord and Thor, but really, Cap made the worst call with the fate of the universe at stake. Vision could just go hide in the the internet like JARVIS did before. And Hulk is still basically an infant. Peter Quill is only a dude in love for the first time. Dr. Strange has a plan, and that is where I will place my bets.
Co-Creator of RunPee, Chief of Operations, Content Director, and Managing Editor. RunPee Jilly likes galaxy-spanning sci fi, superhero sagas, fantasy films, YA dystopians, action thrillers, chick flicks, and zany comedies, in that order…and possesses an inspiringly small bladder. In fact, that little bladder sparked the creation of RunPee. (Good thing she’s learned to hold it.)
It’s been a year ago now, at the end of Avengers: Infinity War. Almost as soon as Thanos got his “mitts” on every stone for the The Infinity Gauntlet, he snapped his giant purple fingers and snuffed out half of all living beings in the universe — people both good and bad, rich and poor, young or old, in a process utterly random and without distinction, race, worthiness — anything. In fact, you are probably dead.
I, for one, AM dead. Gone: snuffed away, dust. My cold, grim, no nonsense message:
“You were slain by Thanos, for the good of the Universe.”
The Snap. 50-50 odds. Now it’s your turn to find out once and for all.
Want to know if YOU survived The Snap? This one little unadorned link will tell you, for good or ill.
But once you know, it’s permanent. No matter how many times I try this site, they still tell me I’m ashes. They remember.
You may as well take a deep breath and know. If you’re dead, like me, our only hope is the Avengers — and Captain Marvel — can bring us back on April 26th, the opening night of Avengers: Endgame. At least RunPee will have Peetimes ready to go, so if you’re still alive, the three-hour runtime won’t make your survivor’s guilt worse. 🙂
Co-Creator of RunPee, Chief of Operations, Content Director, and Managing Editor. RunPee Jilly likes galaxy-spanning sci fi, superhero sagas, fantasy films, YA dystopians, action thrillers, chick flicks, and zany comedies, in that order…and possesses an inspiringly small bladder. In fact, that little bladder sparked the creation of RunPee. (Good thing she’s learned to hold it.)
First off, it’s a Marvel movie, okay? You simply may not leave your seat until the lights come up. In this case, Ant Man and the Wasp is no different. Make your friends — and even strangers — “hold onto their butts.” (Ten points to Gryffindor if you remember where that quote is from.)
Spoilers for Infinity War and Ant Man & The Wasp ahead!
[pullquote]Some extra scenes/tags/stingers are fluffy fun, some add to the plot, and some hint at what’s to come. Some tease you in a sort of parody way, or just send you off with a little laugh. We’ve got a fine stew of all that in Ant Man 2, the 20th film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe.[/pullquote]
My advice: don’t leave until the bitter end.
As the credits roll, for two minutes we see scenes from Ant Man and the Wasp as miniature models, highlights from the film. There are posed dolls; there are miniatures sets; it’s nice and all. Since this bit of Title Credits begins exactly as the movie ends, we don’t call this kind of thing an extra. It’s neat to see, though, with some good music to enjoy while you wait for the big anticipated mid-credits scene.
Some background first : Ant Man and The Wasp takes place roughly before/during/around the momentous events of Avengers: Infinity War. Maybe most of their timelime happens during Thor: Ragnarok, which leads directly into Infinity War.
Seriously awful things happen in the last 20 minutes of IW. I saw it five times in the theater and still bawled like a baby. Peter Parker and Teen Groot destroyed me.
So when I say that I and the audience GASPED out loud in the crucial mid-credits scene of Ant Man 2, I mean it viscerally. It was a gut-punch that surprised us all. It was almost (ALMOST) worse than what happened in Infinity War. This reminder hurt.
[pullquote position=”right”]It’s not like the Ant Man crew are my favorite superheros, and while I’d hoped this ‘small stakes’ lighthearted film would connect to the larger MCU, I was, by the end of the movie, lulled into a sense of contentment.[/pullquote] By then, I’d totally forgotten about The Snap. As the directors surely planned. When The Snap returned, during the mid-credits, making ash of Hank, Hope and the newly-freed Janet — simultaneously stranding Scott Lang in the Quantum Realm — I actually yelped in the theater. A huge audience “Nooooooo!” showed I wasn’t the only one lulled into complacency.
And that is exactly what the Marvel studios bank on. Light, fun movie? Check. Awful last minute universe continuity meant to shock the audience — double check.
So, Scott is left alone in the Quantum Realm (to be fair, Luis, Bill Foster or even Ghost could retrieve him, and maybe he was immune to The Snap by being out of space and time…theories abound), but that doesn’t take the power of the moment away when Hope, Hank, and Janet disappear. Mic drop. End scene.
If you wait for the final, post credit extra, you’re treated to a hint of the world status, Post Snap. Streets are empty, while sirens sound in the distance. We pan through Scott’s empty house, in several rooms, see the TV switch over to the Emergency Broadcast System…and finally land on one of Scott’s giant ants playing his drums. Dire as things are, it’s still an Ant Man movie, providing a grace of comic relief, after the brutal reminder of the state of the universe.
The final nail in the coffin swiftly follows, when the screen fades to black and we see the title card: Ant Man and The Wasp Will Return.
Then a beat passes.
And a question mark pops up, to show: “Ant Man and The Wasp Will Return?”
Nice. Ambiguity.
Then lights come up and you’re left feeling like you saw a cutely made, well-done late phase MCU film: a rollicking good time with refreshingly small stakes (sans the very end).
So, now what?
My theory is that people we didn’t see dissolve are still with us. So, Luis is still in the front of the van. Bill Foster and his Ghost ward know how to operate the Quantum Tunnel. Getting Scott out may be a simple affair, and his knowledge of the Quantum Realm might hold the key to undoing Thanos’ damage.
It’s a long wait til 2019’s March release of Captain Marvel and the as-yet-untitled Avengers 4, due later that summer.
[pullquote]I do have a burning question: How did Hank Pym and family not know Earth was under attack by massive waves of alien monsters in Wakanda? You’d think this wouldn’t be the time for starting a risky new quantum experiment. Personally, I’d be glued to the news of world events.[/pullquote]
And for that matter, in Infinity War, how did Nick Fury, of all people, not realize his planet was in a serious state of war? Shouldn’t he be dialed in to everything the Avengers say or do, at all times? Running around panicking in NYC, he seemed strangely out of the loop.
Here’s the Mid Credit Scene from Ant Man and The Wasp, mixed in with the real-time last moment of Avengers: Infinity War. (2.3 minutes long.) You might need a tissue.
Coda. Final Scene:
What do you think happens with Scott, the Quantum Realm, and the Post-World Snap?
Co-Creator of RunPee, Chief of Operations, Content Director, and Managing Editor. RunPee Jilly likes galaxy-spanning sci fi, superhero sagas, fantasy films, YA dystopians, action thrillers, chick flicks, and zany comedies, in that order…and possesses an inspiringly small bladder. In fact, that little bladder sparked the creation of RunPee. (Good thing she’s learned to hold it.)
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